Journeys in Fandom
Step into the world of fandom with Matt and Tim as they take you on a wild ride through the pop culture universe. This isn't just any podcast - it's a journey with two mates who are unapologetically passionate about all things comics, film, TV and more.
Journeys in Fandom
An Introduction to Warhammer 40,000
As we dust off from an unexpected podcast pause, our ears are perked for the latest twists and turns in the world of Doctor Who. The anticipation for Moffat's return to the TARDIS is palpable, and we're hopeful that the upcoming series will blend the comforting nostalgia with fresh, innovative storytelling. Juggling the logistics of life, we even entertain the wild idea of podcasting live from a hotel room during the UK Games Expo!
Delving deeper into fandom, we delve into the expansive universe of Warhammer, which Matt has been immersed in since the dice-rolling days of 1990. Together, we navigate the stark contrast between the grimdark future of Warhammer 40,000 and the enchanting realms of the Age of Sigmar, shedding light on the game's mechanics and the invaluable community it nurtures. The warmth of nostalgia for tabletop gaming's resurgence takes us back to a simpler time when a young imagination first encountered the wonders of Hero Quest and the magical world it unveiled.
Wrapping up our journey is the inimitable Henry Cavill, whose love for Warhammer is as evident as his Superman cape. Amidst laughter, we reflect on his unexpected visit to Games Workshop and how his personal interests might influence his career decisions, including his foray into the role of executive producer for the upcoming Amazon Warhammer TV series.
Hello and welcome to episode. We don't even know anymore. Delete your time. The latest fandom.
Speaker 2:Yes, we're back.
Speaker 1:It feels like a week from month. Yes, not intentional. Nothing on.
Speaker 2:TV, no, and well, you didn't complete your homework, so that's we.
Speaker 1:Yeah, in my defense, if I may, in my defense, I kind of have a full time job and then a full time job and then I like to sleep occasionally. So I realized I don't actually have time to watch TV Fair enough I did. I did suggest to my girlfriend that we watch trailers and she basically said I've heard of it, it's not so interesting. I went damn that's my TV viewing time. I ruined it, nevermind my plan has failed, but hey, nevermind.
Speaker 2:No, yes, life just got in the way and a month disappeared yeah. But maybe two months have disappeared like nobody's business. Where did that go? Can't be two months, right? It was Roy Rumble, which was the end of January.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, january, oh God, it is two months.
Speaker 2:So we lost an extra game Feb and we still managed not to do anything in Feb. Yeah, and then yeah, maybe all the march has gone.
Speaker 1:Oh well, it's Easter next week, yeah, yeah. And obviously we're.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's early this year isn't it, it's always confuses me. Yeah, but with Doctor who coming out in May spoilers for our new section I think we can make up for it in the May, June, July period of this year. Yes, as we go weekly as we go. Oh God, it's going to be clear, the calendar it's going to be. It's going to be hell, yeah.
Speaker 1:All joking aside, do you reckon we will go weekly? We literally watch Doctor who, then rant for 20 minutes like we did with the?
Speaker 2:other episodes. I think I'm up for the challenge. I'm up for giving it a go, yeah. See how many episodes we can go, and I could probably squeeze it out ready on a Monday. Yeah, yeah, once you get in the flow, it's relatively simple.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's just getting into the flow of just doing it. Yeah, yeah, I might have to do one of these from a hotel room kind of thing, because early. June I'm a UK Games Expo.
Speaker 2:Oh, no excuse.
Speaker 1:I mean I'll do it from a hotel room, it would be fine.
Speaker 2:It would just be a little bit differently darling, but janky.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we can work on that. Yeah, it's great, me and Travelodge. Hello, the beans take to bath, make a stop.
Speaker 2:Oh, actually the Travelodge internet access may well put a hindrance to that. It might have to less video. More audio might have to be on that thing. You might have to phone it in literally.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you might have to use the technology of iPhone.
Speaker 2:Yes, bro, we'll cross that vision. That might be quite fun Bit of technology just to get in the way.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I could also tell you how Games Expo is a world. That would be good fun.
Speaker 2:Well, there you go. Yeah, there's an extra episode. We do two episodes in one. God, yes so what's happened to the news? Loads of stuff. So we've got a Doctor who trailer which we'll watch in a minute.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so the wrestling things happened.
Speaker 2:WrestleMania is two weeks away.
Speaker 1:I was looking at it this morning, yeah.
Speaker 2:So that's coming on board quite nicely actually, yeah.
Speaker 1:It's like we planned it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we didn't have the rock, did we? We did the Roromo review. Then the rock arrived, dropped the ball, managed to pick up the ball again and it's now seems to be rolling quite nicely.
Speaker 1:Yeah so.
Speaker 2:What other news do we do? There was a Doctor who thing and I can't. That helps Besides the trailer. There was a. Doctor who thing, of course. Obviously it's being aired in May, isn't it? You're a Vision Weekend, may the 11th yeah, 11th, and they've called it and it did make me laugh. It's who Vision Weekend, but it looks like Hall Vision. It's like one letter short and it just like I look at it and go, no, maybe not. Oh, dear, yeah, so that's that weekend, so but that was the big.
Speaker 1:Thing.
Speaker 2:The timing, the timings of it. Have you seen the rage over the timings?
Speaker 1:I don't see any rage.
Speaker 2:I'm range proof mate, so it's being simulcasted.
Speaker 1:Ah, isn't it available on Bloody Doodad? A day before we get it.
Speaker 2:No, it's on the same.
Speaker 1:It's on the same time.
Speaker 2:So it's been released to Disney Plus and BBC Iyer Player At the same time, like midnight or something.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:So the Americans? Yeah, technically they get it earlier because they're five hours minimum behind us. So yes, they do get it.
Speaker 1:I saw something saying it was like made attempt for Disney Plus and 11th Rode Clown.
Speaker 2:What the heck. Technically we get it later, but we don't. If you're wanting to stay up to midnight to watch it, and it's going to be shown then normal time on TV six o'clock, seven o'clock, whatever later in the day. So actually, if they do that every weekend I don't know if they're going to do that every weekend we could get ahead of the game and watch it in the morning and get the episode. This is actually working our favour. Certainly for the first one. We could watch it Saturday morning and record it. Well, you're probably in your 10th job.
Speaker 2:You probably won't be there but, hypothetically, we could record it during the daytime.
Speaker 1:And I've got things to do.
Speaker 2:It's not just I sit in my arse all day waiting to record this podcast. I actually have got things to do as well, so maybe we won't do it at night time.
Speaker 1:No, what Tim's actual day job is? He just sits there waiting for me to get a podcast.
Speaker 2:Just sat ready. Tim doesn't exist outside of his room.
Speaker 1:I've just wheeled me into existence.
Speaker 2:I am just like an AI bot, and that's all. I do is to sit.
Speaker 1:Yes, I can see it now.
Speaker 2:That was the controversy and I'm sure back in the day I'm sure there was rage, but they didn't seem to be as much rage as there was, like there used to be back in the day for stuff like that when Americans get things before us. But it's, yeah, very much Disney.
Speaker 1:At least the same day.
Speaker 2:We're getting it six months before and yeah, at least it's a couple of hours If you're willing to stay up. I'm not staying up till midnight to watch it. I'll just watch it the next day, mike if we just watch your telly yeah.
Speaker 1:I'm sure I'll just say up that late.
Speaker 2:No, no, thanks.
Speaker 1:Yeah, back in my day the youngest guy's got stuff six months before we did yeah.
Speaker 2:And the only thing you stayed up for was wrestling, but nowadays they don't do that. So no, people are raging, but it's Disney, and I think now, with the trailer as well, it's really is Disney, isn't it? You can see?
Speaker 1:this when you'll see it.
Speaker 2:But it's Disney all over. There's the stamp on it. We talked about it in previous episodes about ratings. They don't care about the ratings because it's streaming it, the Disney plus in it. It's ratings are irrelevant, because I think it's just like this has been dumped all over. So shall we have a look at the tree law.
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, yes, yes.
Speaker 2:Hopefully this is all going to work smoothly. Give us a thumbs up if you can we're going to get copyright?
Speaker 1:Are we going to get copyright?
Speaker 2:strike for this? No, because if we keep talking over it, it doesn't matter. I'm confident this time, head in hands, whimpering doesn't count as changing the format of it, or wherever it was.
Speaker 1:Well, it may be crying doesn't count.
Speaker 2:It doesn't count as a copyright. Strike Right three, two, one. Go Give me the loving. Where did he come from, I don't know. He sort of popped up at the right moment.
Speaker 1:And then he spoke about time travel. Ruby, do you want to know my secret?
Speaker 2:I have the whole universe at my fingertips.
Speaker 1:And I'm one of my own.
Speaker 2:Okay, so we got three cats If you can't meet me.
Speaker 1:Who are you? I'm the doctor. Tell me, change me.
Speaker 2:It's called the TARDIS, it's the time and space machine. No idea what if I change history by stepping on a butterfly. Well, that's not going to happen, is it?
Speaker 1:Oh, what's wrong With all my adventures? I've never seen anything like this before. Oh my.
Speaker 2:Bridgeton. This place is completely mad. Things seem to be turning more and more supernatural. Is that monsters? No, don't be silly. There's no such thing as monsters. It's just creatures you haven't met yet. There are powers beyond the universe so vast the whole world could slide into the pit. Is this what we're trying to stop? I'm still alone. I need to know if you'll be okay, you'll keep us safe. I will keep us safe. I promise. It's taking me all this time To change this. It's a real ice-wony To do.
Speaker 1:We're going to save the world To change this.
Speaker 2:Everything is possible.
Speaker 1:Everything is possible Time may change me, but I can't restown. So we failed at the TARDIS, we failed at the talking over, didn't we Completely?
Speaker 2:No copyrights, not them. Yes, there we go.
Speaker 1:It's flashy, isn't it?
Speaker 2:It's nice, the budget is on show.
Speaker 1:I have a horrid feeling that Ruby is Rose 2.0. That whole thing of I don't know what I'm here to do, oh God, it just exists. I'm not sure it just exists.
Speaker 2:And also the back of my mind, keep thinking well, they've replaced her already, or haven't they? They've not really announced it, they still haven't sorted that problem out. No, and I feel I like her, I really like her character. But I said that about all the other ones that I like and they've all ended up bad, except for Martha. But there's that little thing in the back of my mind, thinking she's only going to be here for this one series and it's like yeah.
Speaker 2:Oh, no Couple of episodes in the second series, but essentially this is a big one. What else Actually there wasn't. There was only really three or four episodes in that that. I'm seeing A few dotted about, but you've got the main one being the 60s one with Jinx Monsoon and the Beatles. That was loads of shots of that with the music and the notes and stuff, the Bridgeton-esque, whatever era one that one is.
Speaker 1:The only ones they've shown are ones who have already seen bits and pieces.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's like spatterings of other stuff, but the majority of those were just those core episodes. So it's still hiding stuff. I spotted Tenet in there, which again reminds me that he's still lurking out there at the universe. Just still irks me.
Speaker 1:We're still angry about it. What I found interesting when you said oh, this is a tired traveling time and space. Is it safe? I don't know. You do know You've literally been doing this for X years. You are fully aware if it is safe or not.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I still like them and it's exciting to actually want to watch it again, which I'm still like. Yeah, I want to see it because I like him and I like her. I can put aside the fact that she's going. I really hope they don't reference the 14th Doctor much, if at all. Let's just forget about it. It happened. Oh, that was a bit used, did you see? Yeah, moffat has written one of the episodes for this series. We announced it the other day.
Speaker 1:This series.
Speaker 2:Was it next year? It was one of the two, but he's on his Instagram.
Speaker 1:Okay, I have mixed feelings about this, because the Moffat one-off episodes where he was not in charge were really good.
Speaker 2:Yes, so I'm hoping yeah.
Speaker 1:Blink, gunner Fireplace et cetera. But then we had the Moffat era and I hate him.
Speaker 2:But then we had the excited for RTD return and that was not great, although it seems to have got better. So let's not get too excited for a Moffat blink, because we're not going to get it.
Speaker 1:My glasses are rose tinted, mate. These are rose tinted. It's going to be good.
Speaker 2:No, I'm genuinely excited for it. It looks good. The trailer looks good. It's Disney all over. That's the budget that they're throwing at it.
Speaker 1:We'll see what it is, but nice.
Speaker 1:What I'm going to be controversial about. For a change, what I'm hoping is it is just solid and well written and does not rely on duty gap or being awesome or the Disney budget is my fear, because what I don't want to do is try and mask an average story with flashy effects and the top quality actor. I would rather just go to have a solid foundation to go with and then have those lift that higher, rather than having average writing or bad writing and then relying on the acting chops of your cast and the budget of Disney to make it good, fair enough.
Speaker 2:It's all right having them flashy CGI, but if you've got nothing, no substance, as we've seen in previous seasons. You end up with this just dross.
Speaker 1:Again, you've got the old Marvel problem. Where you go? This is garbage, but you're throwing a load of money at it, so it's technically watchable. Yes, so that's good.
Speaker 2:So not long to go, really only a month at a bit. By the time we get another episode out, it might be time to be ready to go. He's drinking his tea. He's got a spit. You almost got me. I didn't see that bit, I think, in the cosmic balance of episodes.
Speaker 1:We're still on a good schedule. I think we had such a run. In short succession we go. I just need to breathe up.
Speaker 2:Fair enough, it was just like a natural break. Natural break before the chaos.
Speaker 1:And you set me homework and something when I got no time to do this. You're saying you're terribly, I'm bad, I know. Have you watched?
Speaker 2:Rebel Moon? No, I've heard, it's rubbish. It is rubbish Because that was Zack Snyder's attempt at Star Wars, wasn't it? Yes it's bad. Essentially, yeah, it's not good. No, I've avoided that. Oh, x-men, the cartoon's out that came out starting Thursday. I need to sit down and watch that. I might watch that tomorrow.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. Apparently that's going to be quite good. I haven't got a X-Men subscription so I can't watch it.
Speaker 2:Oh.
Speaker 1:Sad times.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Admittedly, the reason, the main reason I knew I was coming back was all the memes of Rose Asse.
Speaker 2:Oh, and the Asse gate.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah and the joke being, that scene that they use is the only time she has an ass.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:So people say, well, she hasn't got a bottom, but it's just yes, but she only had a bottom in one scene, literally that one.
Speaker 2:Yes, but gave credit to my girlfriend for not seeing that one for me.
Speaker 1:She's reported back and said oh yes, by the way, the only reason is fantastic. That has helped. Yeah, the internet, yeah, you can't beat it for just rage and just yes, misdirected rage, more than anything else, the internet is the worst, as we have talked about on this podcast a few times before.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, yeah, I don't think I've watched. Why else have I watched? I've just been watching random stuff that has been sort of on my to watch list for a long time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, did you see that there's a new series with what's the other one's name? Anthony Mackie? Oh, yeah, yeah, that twisted metal bass on the computer game from like the 90s, oh I've read an article about him but no, I didn't.
Speaker 2:I heard the thing about him. Well, you saw the first.
Speaker 1:That was the first episode. I giggled. It was fun, so that might be one for the watch list. Ah, cool.
Speaker 2:So who knows?
Speaker 1:Admittedly, I'm on basically my entire viewpoint on one episode. It's good, it might not be good, who knows.
Speaker 2:It was fun, oscar's Oppenheimer won every Oscar. Near enough, didn't it? Yes, I've not seen that film yet I do probably need to go sit down and see it, because it does look really good. I like Christopher Nolan's stuff, but I need to find a weekend to watch it, because it's about five hours long, isn't it?
Speaker 1:Yes, good old Oppenheimer tea. It did win everything, didn't it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think Bar 2, I think it was. Barby won something and one other film something else.
Speaker 1:I can't remember, but yeah won everything.
Speaker 2:So today we're going to talk about your favourite topic, your mastermind topic.
Speaker 1:That is Warhammer yeah if you were sat down in front of the black chair?
Speaker 2:what did you talk about, warhammer?
Speaker 1:Well at work in my actual day job. Many, many, many years ago we actually did mastermind for a Christmas staff meeting and it was meant to be like the company director's doing it, but my boss slash director didn't want to do it, so volunteered me. So my special subject was in fact the David Tennant's era of Doctor who.
Speaker 2:Oh, okay, so they had to go and get the questions for you.
Speaker 1:Yeah, they had to research, research and questions.
Speaker 2:That would be piss easy, because these have been people who don't know anything about the subject, just going online and going David Tennant, doctor who. It would be really easy. Maybe we should do that. Maybe we should do that as an episode. Do write some ridiculously difficult Doctor who questions.
Speaker 1:Well, admittedly, some of the questions were slightly harder than I was actually expecting. How many episodes of Doctor who, david Tennant being in? Oh we, literally. I was only, uh what? Three.
Speaker 2:This is obviously before the 50th and before the 14th Doctor Constance 12, 24, 28, 29, if that was the 50th, 28, up to when he regenerated 20,. Ah, no, no, does it full episodes or mini episodes as well? Full episodes 20, a 28, must be Two series of 12s plus the four specials.
Speaker 1:Three series for a start. Was he yes?
Speaker 2:Oh, the Donna, Donna, okay, yeah, yeah, see, I'm missing 12.
Speaker 1:I know we've already raised 14s from our memory 40 episodes.
Speaker 2:40 episodes, there you go.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think it was something like 43. Could I think they're actually 13 episodes seasons, not 12?
Speaker 2:Oh, 13. Yeah, I've gone already.
Speaker 1:And then there's Christmas specials.
Speaker 2:Oh balls, yeah. Three Christmas specials, yeah exactly.
Speaker 1:So, as you can imagine me, that's not bad actually. Yeah, me Saturday shared how many episodes, tell me. No one, uh lot move on.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Christmas specials.
Speaker 1:Oh sorry, yes, Anyway, we've gone off for a while, Apparently, yeah apparently, when people have the internet, they can actually come up with some horrific questions. But anyway, my actual mastermind subject is going to be a games workshop on the world of warhammer.
Speaker 2:Warhammer, because I know zero, zero, next to nothing.
Speaker 1:And I know I know a little bit about it.
Speaker 2:So we don't want to go into like the seventh degree of nerdom. Give us an intro to warhammer and I'll ask you some questions.
Speaker 1:Well, I've been doing this since 1990. So 10 years.
Speaker 2:No, it's probably like nine actually.
Speaker 1:Yeah, right yeah, 1990, 10 years ago. So well, what do you want to know?
Speaker 2:really yeah. What is it about? Because that's the storyline behind it, oh Christ.
Speaker 1:Make it brief, I appreciate it.
Speaker 2:What's the concept? There we go.
Speaker 1:Okay. So it is a I want to say tactical tabletop wargame, but it isn't, it's multiple ones. So games workshop, coming behind it, own various IPs based on the concept of warhammer and warhammer 40,000. So you've got warhammer age of sigma, which is effectively knights and armor and wizards, so it's high fantasy. And then you've got warhammer 40,000, which is set in the far future of the 41st millennium.
Speaker 2:That's the one that I know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yes, and the idea being it's us, but 38,000 is in the future, and it's what happens to humanity and the fact that everything hates them and wants to kill them. So you've got various yeah, so various races, species or factions factions, that's what I'm looking for. So you've got the Imperium of man, which is the Imperia of God, which are bog standard humans.
Speaker 2:You've got space brains oh you see conventions yes, yeah, they're meant to be eight foot tall, genetically enhanced super humans.
Speaker 1:Effectively, these guys can spit acid and regenerate wounds and literally eat your brain and get your memories. Basically it's proper sci-fi nonsense. The weapon they use is called a bolt gun and the idea is it fires these like mini rocket projectiles and they're like kind of like this and it just goes yeah, if that hits you you're just dead. It's just going to be a mess. You've got what are the main races? Do the Imperia once. First You've got the Assisted of Battle, which are warrior nuns, which are the best. They're my favorite. You've got the Adaptus Mechanicus, which are all basically imagine your car mechanic, if they got too intimate with the car. So they worship machines effectively. So they will side mentally enhance themselves. So basically, flesh is weak and they try to make themselves as compatible as possible with machinery.
Speaker 1:Any more Imperia races, Not like I can think of. I'm sure there are, which I probably forgot. You've then got various alien races. You've got the Elder, or there's an out called Aldari, which are space elves effectively. So think of Lord of the Rings elves in space. You've got Orcs, because of course you have space.
Speaker 2:They just exist.
Speaker 1:Yeah, space orcs. They are literally called space orcs and these guys are the comic relief of Fort UK. They are made from fungus, so they literally reproducifire spores. So if you get an Orc, it's shed spores and the spores end up. If they get dark and covered over, they then hatch like fungus. So once you have one, you can never get rid of them.
Speaker 1:And the joke is that they're all slightly psychic, so they have this little psychic field. So if they believe something works, it does. So their weaponry. If you gave it to your eye it wouldn't function, but if you give it to them they believe as a gun. They believe it works, so it functions. And they just go wait what? What is this madness? So lots of their technology. You go, this shouldn't work, but it kind of does.
Speaker 1:What else you've got? You've got the Tao Empire, which are space communists. Everything is for the great good and they bring in other species to their empire and try and do everything for the greater good. You've got the Necrons, which are think Terminator. Basically, the idea is these guys gave up their flash bodies and convert themselves into machines, which is a bit mental. Yeah, ancient Egypt's in space. You've then got the Tyrannids, which are Xenomorphs, they just are.
Speaker 1:The main one you will come across is a gene-sealer. So if you think of a classic alien's alien, but rather than using his tongue to punch a hole in the head, it will kiss you instead, it will impregnate you via its tongue. It drops a little spore in your throat and the next thing you know you're infected and you end up breathing rubber humans and you're creating this monstrosity. It's that Good fun. So, yeah, there's a whole host of various races and the idea behind it is it's effectively a few hobbies in one. So you've got building of models, painting of models and playing again and actually, for all its ills, it's a really good social experience because you get to hang up your mates, talk nonsense and roll some dice at the same time.
Speaker 2:Cool, so is the mechanics a bit like D&D, then? In terms of D&D it's kind of imaginary, though no, it's really not, because you do it on the board, don't you?
Speaker 1:Yeah, so 30 years ago, 40 years ago, it was heavily role play based. Nowadays it is quite a slick war game. So you will have every figure has a points value and you will play a game to a certain number of points. You can use whatever figures you want to up to that points limit, and every, every figure has its own stat line which will tell you what it can do in the game. And then you're trying to complete the mission, to score points, and your objective is to score more points.
Speaker 2:Your opponent does, so you can bring whatever you like to the table, then as long as it matches up to that points level.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so as long as it's from a faction, so you can bring two. You can bring of space and rings or of tyrannids or of sisters of orcs and then you play against your opponent who does the same. So they're currently on their 10th edition of Warhammer 40,000. So back in my day, when it was the best edition, so in 1993, they used to do like a new edition of five years and I still haven't been given a food making for addition yet. So that came out in 1998. Yeah, back when I was a kid, I know right. But now it's it's quick end ups and now sort of doing a new edition every two or three years and it's just basically a tidy up of rules and stuff like that.
Speaker 1:Interesting yeah fun fact there is a Warhammer badge for scouts and cubs and beavers, is it? Fun fact? I have one. Aha, because not that long ago, I don't think, because I think basically G-Dubs basically sponsored it. You can affect that as well.
Speaker 2:There you go.
Speaker 1:But I joked and said when I was a cub I had every badge that there was possible to have All of them. I was one of those cubs.
Speaker 2:I nearly did, but didn't. I had a load, but didn't finish the set.
Speaker 1:And to be told it was a Warhammer badge and, knowing I didn't have one, mortally wounded me. I went nope, this cannot be so. When we had the cubs and scouts recently, I said yep, I will do whatever you want me to. However, I have one condition I want a badge. That's all I want in life.
Speaker 2:You can buy one For 80 pence. You can buy one.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I earned it. That's the key. I had to earn that badge.
Speaker 2:Back in the day you couldn't buy them. Oh, we didn't have internet when I was in the we didn't have internet back in our era you got given the badges, but now you can just go ahead and buy them. So I could go buy all the ones I'm missing. I'm digressing now. I forget Warhammer. I'm looking at all these cubs and scouts. Oh my Lord, there's loads of little change. Magic, the gathering badge. There you go. What, yeah?
Speaker 1:Why was I not informed? It's a magic, the gathering badge.
Speaker 2:Yeah, there's one here, 80 pence. You can go buy that yourself. I want to earn it. I've earned these badges. There's also a Royal Marines badge. Geez, what they do to the cubs and scouts these days. Here's your AK-47. Just go and run at that trench and you'll get your badge.
Speaker 1:I'm not sure Royal Marines use AK-47s, mate. Oh no, yeah, that's a bit more or other crutches, to be fair.
Speaker 2:It's more militant, isn't it? Here's your. It's more militant, I'm going to say here's your terrorism badge. Geez, yes. So back to Warhammer. I have to slight digression into child soldier in the UK.
Speaker 1:Yeah, child soldiering in the UK. So yeah, so we got into that digression, but in fact you can now actually get scout badges for Warhammer and Magic at FX and all the exciting things. That's really cool. All that is that.
Speaker 2:It kind of encourages that for kids, because I think obviously nowadays Warhammer, yes, d&d, all that kind of stuff is really popular with kids, but back when we were kids it was very niche, wasn't it? Yes, no offense, but you were a nerd if you did that. Yes, but now as we've talked about many podcasts. Being a nerd or being a geek is mainstream, so it's not as yeah, and obviously there's a massive industry behind it now, whereas back in the 80s and 90s there was, because it was in its infancy.
Speaker 2:No, but now you're looking at no exactly, exactly. Obviously, we're going to get onto Henry Cavill at some point, but obviously people like that who promote it there's so much money behind it all.
Speaker 1:Well, for context, during COVID Games Workshop made more profit than Google did. Wow, literally it was a running joke, I think. They released a statement which effectively said we have too much money, we do not know what to do with it. We have paid back every penny of government support we've been given. We've given all of our staff a massive bonus. Um call, I guess. Well, it makes sense.
Speaker 2:It's logical. People just sat at home painting figures, weren't they?
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly, exactly. If you couldn't go out everywhere. And, oh my pile of shame, I've got this. Boys, we've all been planning for this for 50 years it's got to be.
Speaker 2:I'm just going to crack on and get it done. Yeah, so it's interesting, I suppose as well. That's that's always what put me off. Or was the painting of stuff? I just doubt the patience for it. And I remember when I was a kid I was like, oh, this looks really cool. Because I remember I have a vivid memory of going to Bedel Hall there in Sheffield and they had a Games Workshop there.
Speaker 2:I was like, oh, what's going on there? When I realized you had to paint everything, I was like, yeah, I don't know about it Then.
Speaker 1:I just walked off, Well um, so as a proper youngster again, this is the. This is the late 80s, early 90s kind of thing. Our family used to go down to Dorsey every year to stay in a caravan and to explore around there, and I remember finding a proper like old school hobby shop.
Speaker 2:Oh, that trains and everything you used to get in there.
Speaker 1:Well, yeah, it wasn't a Games Workshop, it was a proper old school hobby shop. So you had like the old, like proper metal, like D&D figures and loads of random things Right, gotcha Right to walk in and went this is so cool, I knew all this in my life and like they would have like the display boards, and I went oh, this is, this is my jam. And I went yes, I am hooked. And the joke was do you remember the game Hero Quest?
Speaker 2:Ever played Hero Quest? Oh, yeah, yeah, never played it. The best game ever. I always wanted it. Wife played it and said it was awesome.
Speaker 1:Yeah, If, if. For those who are listening who have never played Hero Quest, go to YouTube and Google. Why is Hero Quest the greatest game ever and there are some videos that are genius.
Speaker 2:They released it, didn't they Quite recently? Yes, they did. Yeah, Hasbro, uh, yeah. Yeah, Hasbro re-released it, yeah, with the add-ons and all sorts. But yeah, and I remember coming out and thinking, oh, I want that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so that's that's what got me into this whole world, because the original was done by MB in conjunction with Games Workshop. So Games Workshop figures.
Speaker 2:Um, I think it's all things the box.
Speaker 1:No, no, no, no, no, no, sorry, so uh, mootland, mootland, Bradley, games or every game I've ever played. Yeah yeah, yeah, and in conjunction with G-Dubs. And inside the box there was a little pamphlet that said if you'd like to paint your miniatures, dial us number. So we rang the number and that was a mistake, because 34 years later I am poor and G-W has had all my money.
Speaker 2:I always thought it was D&D related because obviously there's like the Barbarians, the Orcs and all that kind of stuff. I didn't realise Games Workshop. But it kind of makes sense because at the time Games Workshop.
Speaker 1:Again back in that era. This is before. Well, games Workshop released the first edition of Warhammer in 1982, four that era. But what it was? It was quite heavily role-play based, but their initial thing was to have their own IP but also to support other fantasy ranges like D&D. So they would borrow a lot of ideas. So again back in this era, everyone borrowed from everyone else. So the idea was you had a generic, barbarian generic was a generic yeah, yeah, Because they're not copyrighted.
Speaker 1:Obviously, you can do anything, yeah but some of the creatures in Hero Quest were like. There was a creature type called the Firmor or Femir. Basically it's one eyed cyclopean lizard thing with huge tail and a big axe and looked really cool, and that is a Games Workshop copyright. So when they re-released it, it's now called an abomination, like the big fish man, because obviously they didn't own the rights to some of the creature names, which was quite fun, and that's what got me into this hobby 30, 34 years ago. I was eight.
Speaker 2:Wow, there you go. Yeah it's quite like you kind of like it's often hobbies you have when your kids don't stick to they, or you kind of you grow out of stuff or you get into other things. But yeah, it's quite cool that, something like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we've always joked and said there are two types of hobbyist you start young, you then leave it in your teenage years or late teenage years when you discover girls and drink, and then you come back to it Is it, is it in your oldie is? Or you just stick to it, and I was one of ones that just stuck to it because, again, like I would be in the games works of every weekend, I Basically got to 18 and the manager at the time said we might as well pay you because you're here all the time anyway. Cool, that was. That was a good job interview. That was yeah, you'll hear, for a weekend. We might as well pay you for it.
Speaker 2:I was just kind of you dream job, isn't it? It's kind of like, yeah, I would, I would have do that.
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah, so I did. I did do that for five years. Yeah, yes, that was a good fun, but yeah, so talking of Games works from where it's gone. Obviously, you've now got Henry Cavill, who is heavily involved with Promote not only just promoting no, I can't hate the word nerd culture but that, that element.
Speaker 2:Oh yes, that is PC building, doesn't he as well? It's not just that he promotes that. Yeah, he just promotes it great yeah.
Speaker 1:And obviously he turned up to games workshops. Head office Didn't tell him he was coming to the rocked up and went hello and basically came to us with oh god, there's a cavill here. Hi, have a tour.
Speaker 2:That's quite nice in a way, because it's just like him being a normal human being and not like how he's called the sistering up. Say, henry wants to come look around, he's just a normal pictures up and what was?
Speaker 1:Hearing feedback from those that were there. He took photographs and selfies with every single member of staff in the building and any and every customer who was there. If they wanted a picture, they got a picture. It was not a quick question, it just happened. But yeah, obviously, when they realized he was there, they whisked him off to someone behind the scene stuff and showed him some of the cool stuff as well, which asked me more or don't get to see. But obviously now, thanks thanks to that and him being a keen hobbyist himself, we're getting the Amazon.
Speaker 2:Warhammer TV series and Arguably him getting the boot or walking from the Witcher. We should go into that as well, kind of let me pay the way for that, didn't it? Also Superman as well? Yeah, the rocks going him over, and Superman. So, yeah, so it's always it all kind of worked out for the best, just going back. So obviously the Games workshop things in HQ to not him, isn't it? Yes, can anyone just turn up and go always like you have to book, or yeah.
Speaker 1:So what our world itself is Lenten industrial state. So they have a shop area and Waterboard itself is a huge open plan gaming area. So they've got loads of tables. They can do massive Gaming events. What they've also got this place called bugman's bar. So if you just want to go hang out, drink up a coffee and chat with mates, you can and they've also got a museum which you can.
Speaker 1:I think that's a, that's a pay to enter, but you can literally. They've got Exams of models from when they started up until now. Cool, they've got these huge diaramas that have taken like months and months to build, with hundreds and thousands of figures on, and they are absolutely mental and actually, just if you, it's just a, just an interest to walk around the museum. To be fair, I've done it a couple of times now and it's you just go. Yeah, this is, this is good, but the a it's, you can just rock up and go and play a head office, it's a good fun to see what it says about the TV series.
Speaker 1:Lots of it is mainly rumor at the moment. Obviously, I think Cavill is cited as executive producer.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they got the IP for Amazon. What worries me, though, is Amazon dropped the ball with oh no, I suppose they did. They did a right with Reacher, so okay, I'll phrase that.
Speaker 1:They dropped the ball with Lord the Rings, but with Henry Cavill on board, who is an average, average fan and and I think it also depends on, like the talking estate Isn't overly fast with what you do with Lord of Rings, because it's done, it's not, yeah, and it's not an evolving entity where it's games workshop will be.
Speaker 2:They are militant and also yeah, because, like Lord of Rings, it's not, there's a note, there's no new content, whereas, yeah, a lot of their reputation will be banked on that being good. Yes, that makes sense.
Speaker 1:And bringing it how it was. Interestingly, there were some fun rumors about why it went a bit quiet on the TV front, because Games workshop lesson they are. So it is think of it as Two companies in one. You've got a group of hobbyists who are there because they really like the hobby and A group of shareholders who are there because you really like money. Yeah, and the two coexist. So sometimes they both pull in the same direction and other times the wrong person gets involved with a wrong thing. So there were rumors that the TV series is all going to be quiet because some of the contract stuff hadn't been done. I don't know viral lawyer and they just gone and and somebody IP had been a bit weird and they're actually actually given the rights to like the space marine to Amazon for about five minutes and you go, better fix that. So yeah, but I think that's all been. That's called come out in a wash. Now that was all sort, but I think the the main rumor.
Speaker 1:There's a Story or in series and novels based on a character called Eisenhorn who's like, I think, would inquisitor who think which finder effectively. So they will go and they will find like heretics and demons and mutants and Dispose of them. Yeah, and actually there are lots of books written by I'm gonna get this wrong, it's either dad Abnal or Bill King. There's there's lots of books based on this character that they can then draw from, but it keeps it quite a small world Rather than going. This is what I'm up.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah because I think that's it, you've got to. If you've got a massive, massive world, how do you? Might be the wrong analogy, but it's like the D&D movie, the relate latest one how do you create something in a world that's so massive that you people new people like me can get into without getting completely lost?
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, if you, if you use talking as an example, so in the Hobbit and the fellowship, you stick with a Small group of characters in a much larger world, yeah, and that will then expands as required and and yeah, I don't want you can do this you can do the same thing with you focus on a core group of characters, but then you can add in the whole wider universe, without getting bolted down, in fact, that this is a massive universe.
Speaker 1:Yeah, if you think yeah, cuz like the, the Imperium of man, it's a joke of like it's millions of planets and you go. Well, if every planet has its own culture and style and Etc, how do you even bring that into a cohesive story? You have to go. Actually, let's tell stories in this universe. So something like focusing on a character and a character that the fans will know but it's also robust enough to introduce it to newbies. It's probably your best plan, because otherwise it's just gonna be a Disaster, because it actually, if you go before you watch the TV series, you need to do 40 hours of reading before you can watch it now Make Like the bit, like the Witcher idea.
Speaker 1:If you know the idea behind the witchy, you go. Oh yeah, that's, that's really good. If you need to, you can go. It's a bloke resort. I can understand what's happening and then learns ago.
Speaker 2:I never played the games, read the books but was able to get into before, before it went weird, the story, so it was fine.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think you know all honesty, that's, that's what they will do. They will focus on a, on a select group of characters in a Confined environment, and then expand that into a wider world. Well, yeah, because otherwise it will just go mad.
Speaker 2:If it's successful, you can just kind of, yeah, spread it out as you move along.
Speaker 1:Yes, exactly, exactly.
Speaker 2:Excellent. Well, there we are. I think there's quite a lot of interesting stuff there. I didn't know after that stuff.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, that's, that's the. The running joke is, I forget a lot of times how much I know about this, because you go Is the classic example. Like someone come in and go I thought I want to paint this, how do I do it? And you just go. Oh well, all you do is, and you give them like a half hour lecture on how you do it and they go sorry, just what? Yeah, of course, for me at second nature, because you've got 30 plus years of experience when you say it, whereas to a to a newbie, they're going sorry, start again Again.
Speaker 1:Like we had a chap come in he goes oh, I've got a model, but it won't stick to its base, it just keeps breaking off. I went well, are you using the right glue if you painted it first, because you won't get proper Cohesion and I said worst case to worst, or just pin the damn thing and even like that sort of terminology, gun. Oh yeah, you just take a safety pin, you drill a hole in it and stick it, stick it in and, literally, safety pin it together. Awesome, yeah, it's. Yeah, it's just a. Yeah, you sometimes forget how much you know without thinking about how much you know it's. I think that's a, that's a nice way. Any hobby that you've been exposed to something for so long, yeah you go. This is second nature, because you just learned it. Virus most effectively.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like because you your it bases your main thing, isn't it? If you talk to me about it, I just look at you blankly, go I don't understand. Yeah, where is? I would do the reverse and go this is all hammer. I can talk to you forever and make you glaze over.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, and it's good. I think people got the passion for it and I think, yeah, it's a matter of what you always say, it's a matter what you like. As long as you got passion for it, that's fine. Yeah, get that, and the fact you get to work with it in the context of a job, it's pretty awesome.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, it's good fun. It's good fun, brilliant.
Speaker 2:So I have no idea how long I've been talking for yes, for those of you listening, we have some technical problems in the middle, but we iron them out, so you're no other difference. I think we've talked for enough time on that. I'm sure you could talk for another two hours Minimum.
Speaker 1:I mean, if you let me, I would yes. So We've got, oh god, rough remainder couple weeks.
Speaker 2:Yes, that's probably be the next yeah podcast, I would think, because that'll roll nicely into the doctor who Mid-May I think that'll work, what? Quite well, we might have to squeeze some fails in between.
Speaker 1:Yeah, admittedly, I I know I can place a bet that I will have feedback on this episode from From one of our listeners and he will say Matt, you have not shouted enough clouds today. So therefore I'm going to apologize for not shouting a cloud today, but next time for a verse for many. And then you to your doctor who Shout out we that we put your clouds Horizon for the new series. Yeah, I think the best bit yeah, the best bit feedback I had was I'm. I don't like it when you're enjoying things.
Speaker 2:Thanks, I think you'd be doing positive, oh, there'll be something. There'll be something that just you kind of go no, stop doing that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we'd have to wait and see.
Speaker 2:So yes, fun, fun, fun well, right, yeah, that on that note, we will. Yes, for the introduction to war hammer.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm sure at some point we will revisit this.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly, Literally. I'd so happy down for a weekend, oh Tim painting figures. Yeah, how was your little one? Eight, oh perfect age.
Speaker 2:Indoctrinated.
Speaker 1:Did you like money?
Speaker 2:Yeah, he kind of likes the he likes gaming, so I probably would quite like to play with actual figures. So actually, yes, it's prime real estate Excellent now you get creepy.
Speaker 1:I Guess that's why that's my go-to. I can make it weird.
Speaker 2:Until next time.
Speaker 1:Another thing related paper podcast.
Speaker 2:He's gonna say goodbye, goodbye, yeah, oh yeah.